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Thread: Front 'classic size' wheel bearing upgrade?

  1. #1
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    Front 'classic size' wheel bearing upgrade?

    Current uprating options?
    I tried to bring this thread back to life in driving and handling but no response so a fresh thread here.

    I'd like to explore current options here.

    1. Sixgunracing used to sell a kit that allows you to convert to the 05+ STi bearing/hub setup to 5x100, but the web site is now dead? Would have been nice solution!
    2. WRC spares sell uprated 5x100 hubs with Audi bearings installed but Rodney says they have to have STI drivesahfts? I have a UK '00 car, but not sure which diff I have but it's OE. There is also the small matter of cost = 900 for a pair!!!
    3. Machine current hub/knuckles for Audi A6 bearings, but which ones? Would the hub need modifying or just the knuckle and is there any issues with driveshaft fitment.
    4. Fitting modied 114 hubs. Slimming the knuckle and moving a hole to mate with my coilies doesn't seem too bad a job. Does the bottom ball joint still fit? I would redrill for 5x100 studs.

    I've got myself some spare complete hubs with the intention of rebuilding for annual swapping/maintenance. I've already had the pleasure of fitting new bearings to original hubs. The first time I fitted new bearings that I repacked with Redline grease onto brand new hubs, in freshly painted knuckles but this lasted 2 years of trackdays. The second set was new bearings on same hubs and no redline grease. This set has done one trackday and already I can see some play. I intend to add more cooling as existing is not enough but changing hubs on a regular basis is a chore. I used NSK labelled bearings the second time.

    Option 3 seems the most feasible but I need the questions answered and anything else I should look out for. Also option 4.

    Option 4 from previous thread by Sjobing:

    With some machining done it's possible to use the newer 114.2 hubs on the old uprights and with the old wheels.
    I've done that on my my03 STi and never had any issues with bearings afterwords. Pictures of my hubs machined to fit old wheels (5x100) and old style coilovers:

    You have to change the bolt pattern a little:




    And you have to make the width a bit smaller:



    And if you like me already got lot of rims in 5x100 you have to re-drill the bolt pattern to fit this(on the one on the top I've made it to a litle smaller outer diameter to fit my small brakes that i use in the winter):

    [/QUOTE]

  2. #2
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    Option 2:


    This uses Audi A6 bearings but needs STI driveshafts R180?


    Not sure why Rodney said that these were only STi, perhaps he meant wide track. Are all pre widetrack, front shafts interchangeable (upto MY05)?
    Last edited by Floyd; 28th August 2012 at 12:18.

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  4. #4
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    Interesting thanks BT. Their option can supply just the bearing with modified hub for 5 x 100


    or complete modified knuckle but I didn't realise that it needed more modding than the work that Sjobing has done with his. I already have a roll centre kit so I'd hope that this would fit the later cars:

  5. #5
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    roll centre kit is the same classic or new-age...........

    me thinks i may get a few old knuckles and see what we can machine them to suit...........

    alyn

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    Senior Member Arch's Avatar
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    Got a couple of old hubs here Alyn if you want them sent down.

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    might be handy, saves splitting 'good' ones

    cheers Arch

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    What's your plan Alyn? Option 3?

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    well most cost effective would appear to be op3, all depends on a number of measurements

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    Rodney said that it took their machine shop a while to get it right so lots of measuring!

  11. #11
    Senior Member Arch's Avatar
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    Thts coz del boy was doing the measuring

  12. #12
    Senior Member 2pot's Avatar
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    I've tried to piece the following info together, from various sites and my own trawling.

    Assuming the standard front bearing is 72mm od x 42mm id x 38mm width. I can't find an Audi A6 bearing, yet, with that id.
    Assuming the std rear bearing, not STI, is 65mm od x 38mm id x 52mm width.
    But, if those STI hubs, pictured above, are Audi A6, then surely they are 42mm id? As I believe STI rears to be 72mm od x 42mm id x 52mm width.

    At standard size bearings, the only ones I can find, that consistently cross references as a high capacity version, are Koyo:
    Front 46T080704X or W0133-1653046
    Rear 46T080705C or W0133-1623456
    Both roller bearings.

    Or German made:
    Optimal front 971707
    Optimal rear 972709

    IF the standard subaru front bearing is NTN 4t-cri-08A01, as mentioned on many US sites, then, according to the same sites, it is rated at 75,000 lbs (whatever that means?)
    The uprated NTN bearing is 4t-cri-0823, rated at 82,500 lbs. This is also Nissan 40210-94N00
    That uprated NTN bearing lasted 6 months of severe usage, same as the standard NTN bearing, when tested by the same user.

    Hope that info kick starts something.
    Last edited by 2pot; 31st August 2012 at 11:05. Reason: additional info

  13. #13
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    No idea which A6 bearing, not looked into dimensions of them yet. I found the NTN stuff when looking for DIY front bearing change instructions. I think the 'uprated' bearings were a red herring.

  14. #14
    Senior Member 2pot's Avatar
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    What about these audi bearings 82mm od x 42mm id x 37mm
    W0133-1619820 or Quinton Hazell QWB720 (SNT/SKF made in France) or Optimal 100056 (made in Germany)
    Or
    Audi
    72mm od x 42mm id x 37mm
    Or
    Audi
    75mm od x 42mm id x37mm
    Last edited by 2pot; 31st August 2012 at 11:43. Reason: add part no

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    Good info, thanks. Looks like option 3 is going to be tried first

  16. #16
    Senior Member 2pot's Avatar
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    Well, I give up on the mythical, front audi a6 bearing conversion.
    82mm (81.98)x 42mm(42.01) x 37mm(36.97) is:
    Audi 5000 '86 - '88 (75mm on earlier)
    Audi 100/200 auto '89 - '91
    Also, if that's the correct bearing, then I don't think it uses separate inner and outer seals.
    I suppose you could still use a subaru outer seal, as you'd be machining from the inside?? And run, like Audi(?), without an inner seal.
    Anyone put me right?
    Last edited by 2pot; 30th August 2012 at 11:41.

  17. #17
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    Sounds reasonable! Where were you looking for the whell bearing info?

  18. #18
    Senior Member 2pot's Avatar
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    Countless cross reference charts on the web! Then I bought a qwb720 bearing and measured it.
    Hope Alyn is making progress? I'd like to buy some form of modified hub very shortly.
    Always assuming, that's the bearing size he's got in mind?!
    Alyn?
    Last edited by 2pot; 31st August 2012 at 11:25.

  19. #19
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    Anyone who tracks there car regularly and puts a decent amount of lateral g into the bearings will need them. I don't want to have to keep changing my bearings regularly as I don't have the time, plus it's boring.

    Ideally I'd like a solution before the next trackday at the Ring and Spa in October...

  20. #20
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    That's 2 of us then

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